Monday, February 28, 2011

Equity in the TDSB

This is something we have talked about endlessly in class in terms of equality.

read the article and tell me what you think?

http://www.parentcentral.ca/parent/education/schoolsandresources/article/945360--rich-schools-get-richer-thanks-to-private-cash

212 comments:

  1. I'm not saying this is the solution but what I believe the goverment should do is place some sort of stimulus into those poor neighbourhoods and tighten there hand and create firm caps on the amount of money able to be generated from those excedingly rich comunties and councils. Because in the article it said there are no rules and the ones they have are lax. Thats were I would start of to try and create a solution.

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  2. I think the government could decrease funding to richer neighborhoods and increase the funds to the "poor" neighborhoods

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  3. i believe that the government should lower the taxes on everything because one day they're going to witness the war that is happening in their own country, a war that is between us and them.

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  4. i also agree with Thamil because i think the is that the government is scared of what might happen if the wrong person that kind of money. so they would just send is to neighborhoods that have less violence and killings

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  5. @ master chief the funds for all the school are the same just that the extra money comes from parents and fundraisers. So they can't really decrease their funding since they might say that's unfair and use it against the government somehow. They could put a limit on how much money a school could have or the extra funds they are getting are aloud, but some how they will still get around that. They could just increase the funding for the "poor" neighborhoods.

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  6. @cameron those taxes are essential Even though theyre a pain they help pay for many thing we need in society today. And I dont beleive we would have a war over taxes as weve been paying them since like the 1800 here in canada.

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  7. @ tron how did violence get involved with this?

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  8. @ Cameron they already lowered the taxes I think it use to be 15% with all the diffrent taxes together.

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  9. yeah thomas i know but if the funds from the government r gone then when the council donates money it would be equal funds

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  10. it would be but there is always a loop hole in any contract or rules.

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  11. I think that the goverment should work out a better system that includes all the schools so they get an equal share.

    I agree with zac because it would be best because if there a problem they should try to find a soultion instead of makeing it look like someone else(the parents)are the reason there so rich.

    mr cheney example is a good way to show what they mean because like on a scale the top number will keep getting higher and higher and the lowere will get lower till theres a giant gap.

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  12. @ Zak, the many thing we need are to be the very things stand against, for instance, the condos they build, the walmarts that are constructd. this is tearing down the environment and is a wast of money like the condos they build that are 80-100 storries high

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  13. @ Thomas i am talking about the taxes that they steal from us in the mail. the ones that after we pay for the objects that we buy

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  14. @ tron the condos they build now are mostly in areas where there are old buildings and they need to tear it down people need a place to live.. The walmarts where are we going to get our groceries for, for a not so much lower price from the other stores.

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  15. I think this is not showing equal rights to the students cause they say every child is equal but this is just lieing. Is this what they want thier child to learn. Cause maybe they wont have such money to get all these privliges and then what will they do they wont beable to pay for an art course or they wont be able to afford for thier kids to take the ib exam which is about $1200.

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  16. @cameron who says tax money goes to building condos. They go to building school and public facilities I highly doubt that the tax money goes to build condos.

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  17. its is about equity, but i see it more as lazyness, these schools are all in the rich areas because the people in the parent concil, work hard to get that money, so their kids can have a better ed. and i dont think it is fair to give that money, which they worked for, some schools with lazy parents, just sitting in their chairs, waiting for the money to role in. if they want to give their child a better ed. they should get the time to go to their childs school and go help. then go and wait for a miricle to happen

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  18. this kind of thing is hard to stop because both sides are right because if the parents want they can give the children what they want them to have because they are their kids and they want them to have really good education but if this goes on racism will also countinue

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  19. @ tron so you mean like how some tv stations are getting payed with our taxes even though they already get funding, it was on the news a long time ago.

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  20. @ zak it does build condos since the money is from the government, and thats the tax money.

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  21. thamil the goverment wont stop paying funds to those schools cause the people who are in the goverment like Rob Ford want votes so they make promises like funding.

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  22. @ everyone up there /\ would you be happy if you brought in a massive pay role for your school, and half of it doesn't even get spent on you, but on people who are just waiting for the money??

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  23. i also agree with thamil it would be the next best thing to do in terms of tryign to ever things out in both areas.

    On the map in the articial the school swansea it a really good school and they have enought money to have a pool because thats where they had the cardboat boat race this year.

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  24. @Thomas i mentioned it when i was stating that when the government does not trust the neighborhoods with gang violence and murders and sometimes the Walmarts they build are not needed because there is already a grocery is already there

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  25. @beng I think it would be unfair to have them go and wait for a miracle.
    Because that would be taking away the resources they worked for. We cant just look at on side of the spectrum we have to look at the other what if you were those rich parents who put alot of work into getting that money and want your child to have all the materials possibly available. Its hard to balance both.

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  26. @ tron that is just hypocritical since the government is all about helping kids getting an good education, but instead they keep the money away from neighborhoods like that.

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  27. @thomas how do you know the money is from the goverment. It's most likely private companies building those condos like quartz,etc. The goverment builds metrohousing homes for the needy, and shelters.

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  28. @ el presidente not all of it is from the government just like a tiny fraction of it like to tear down that area then the company just buys that piece of land.

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  29. I think that the government should put a limit to how much the parent council in these richer neighbourhoods can fundraise and/or earn because then it's more equitable. But like Mr Cheney said, the people in these neighbourhoods will find a way to bend or break the rules so they can earn the money like they had before.

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  30. @ Thomas, sometimes the government can be greedy and untrustworthy. they say one thing and they're doing another. its the difference between heads and tails

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  31. @everyone who reads this- do you think some schools spend the school money on thing that dint need to be bouught or is the schools using the funds for things the students need.

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  32. @ adam what if the parents just don't have that kind of money to spend all this would have not happened if it wasn't for salavry it is like the domino effect because what happened cause even though slavary ended those people still never got equity because the salve owners were rich so the decendents had money to relay on but the decendents from slaves have nothing to relay on.

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  33. @alyssa true eg at a bake sale they could buy all the cookies for like 1000$

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  34. @zak i dont mean them loosing their learning products, thats the governments problem, if they dont support enough money, im talking about the money the parents in the rich schools, work hard to get that money in their school. each school, (i assume) starts off with the same amount of money, although those for schools, bring in that extra, so their children, could have a better education, its not their fault that other schools parents dont do the same, i see it as only fair that the money that you make, gets spent on you

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  35. @stephanie they might be using the money for things that don't need to be bought but what would be an example of something that the students don't need?

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  36. @adam i agree with usman what if the praents dont have the money or(example)the parents have more then 1 kid and all the kids go to the same school and they need to pay 30 4 each kid some parents dotn have that kind or money and with all the job losses money is the problem.

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  37. @stephanie I found an example of something that didn't really need to be bought. So if you scroll down in the article, it lists the Top 20 schools and what they spent it on. And at St. Marcellus Catholic School, they spent $325 for a DJ at the dance-a-thon. The dance-a-thon was their biggest parent fundraiser where they spent $5775. I don't think that was necessary. I mean, just because the have the money doesn't mean they should spend all that. But that's what I think and they probably think differently.

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  38. @alyssa well its not really what the students it would be liek spendign alot of money on art when they dont need to liek they buy alot of extra stuff when they should only buy what they need and more when they need it.

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  39. @stephanie yeah so maybe they buy stuff for art programs that is unecessary but don't you think that spending that much on a dance-a-thon is also an extra thing that doesn't need to be bought.

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  40. @alyssa see that what i mean liek our school does dances with a dj but one we can afford and that cost a reasionable amount not liek the school u mentioned

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  41. @ alysaa its no wrong to fund but the problem is that the school is asking for funds like an art class cost 100 bucks

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  42. i agree with Alyssa about government should put a limit to how much the parent council in these richer neighborhoods can fund raise and/or earn because then the bottom schools will be able to reach that amount or atleast 3/4 of that amount and then it's going to be more equitable. But i also think that some parents should take initiative and give some money too because some parents don't do that, it's different if they can't afford it but there are some parents who just don't want to give any money to the school's fundraising activity they just don't want to be part of this.

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  43. @traundeep well it depends on the amount of student but a dance for $5775 and the dj alone cost $325 i think is a waste of there money.

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  44. I Agree with stephanie Mr.cheney explained it properly because the system wont listen to there "minions" about there mistakes and imperfection because they think there the perfect TDSB council and doing the right thing for there student and teachers and its like there hypocrites because they "preach" equality and all sorts of stuff but when you really see they actually dont follow the things themselves so its messed up because there expecting us to follow rules that they wont and we get punished but if teachers question the system the are told a lie and students arent supposed to do that.

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  45. hitakshee you cant tell a person they cant fund to much the schools asking the parents to pay fees for admission and to go for the exams and have art classes

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  46. @ usman, i understand that that some parents dont have a lot of money, but not every parent dosent have the time to come and help they are the ones who could come and volunteer, so that the school can save money instead of hiring people, so that they can make a better school, and great fundraisers to bring in more money, for example the spring mix, we have so many people come and so many people come and help, also like half of those people, dont even come from beaumonde and we make a lot of money. which shows that lots is possible, if you are not lazy

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  47. @tarun yeah asking for $100 for an art program is a bit much. But I guess if they can afford it but still.

    @stephanie I think that they can afford that DJ but it's so expensive. Why can't they spend that on other things or maybe donate it to a charity like our school does because their school has more money than ours and they're spending it on a DJ.

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  48. I think the money raised my parent council should be evenely spread around the tdsb

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  49. @ alyssa do you really think that $100 for an art program is a bit to much even if they can afford it.

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  50. tarundeep i agree with you about telling alyssa that "its not wrong to fundraise but the problem is that the school is asking for funds like an art class cost 100 bucks" but don't you think that the parents should understand that since in Canada their child(s) get's free education they should atleast donate some amount of money because it's not like other countries (such as India, Pakistan and many more) were the parents have to pay fees for kids education. it is different if they can't afford it and if it is something like that then i think that the parents should talk to the teacher or the principal of the school, and it's also not like the school is asking for thousands of dollars. so i agree and disagree with you. with you.

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  51. @ stephanie i does sound like that is a waste, but think of how much profit they probably brought in, plus if the parents want to do that, its their choice, which what i see they could have spent on text books etc.

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  52. @alyssa that hundred dollars for the art program could be another way the parents are secreatly bending the rules becuase which school is gonna say no to more money.

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  53. hitakshee you guys are wrong because it is their earnings to spend and they should be able spend how much they want it is not their falut that others are not as 'rich' as them or mybe it is but thats not the point they should be aloud to spend as much as they want

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  54. steph what do you mean about $5775 for dance

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  55. well tarundeep i am not telling them to pay too much what i am trying to say is that when their is not limit to this then like Mr. Cheney said the top once are going to be the top once and the bottom are going to be at the bottom. And if the government want's to make all the school be equitable then i think that they should come up with something like this otherwise the same thing is going to continue forever.

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  56. @alyssa ya i agree our school does many charities like build a school and me to we i wonder if other schoold i mean the rich one donate some of there money to charities.

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  57. Its hard on most parents because the richer schools get better things and when there kids hear about that it hurts them and makes them feel like there a lower level citizen and when they tell there parents the parents feel like there not doing enough for there kids but they cant do anything because they cant afford mainly in a reccesion when most parents are doing hard labor and the rich familys r doing softer things like businesss or a are managers or bosses of companys

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  58. There is something wrong with my computer, when i over the "Equity in the TDSB" it would shut my computer down .. it happened twice .. but looking at the comments i think i have the memo clear, as tron master was talking about that they should donating money to the more poor ones than the more "richer" ones as he says .. i agree because the one that are a bit "richer" have at least some money and the poor don't have anything so they can balance it out and have a balanced and equal life .. my definition of equity is because fair. I choose fair because that word is really strong and it is used in many ways, but it best describes Equity. If one fund has way more money than the other, thats not fair, they should equal it and make some minor adjustments and make it fair.

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  59. @usman I get where your coming from but they shouldnt be allowed to just spend excedingly large amounts of money there should be some caps and I doubt that those excedingly rich want to see other citezens in this great country they call home to get poorer and poorer.

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  60. hitakshee paying for courses is not right cause thats not fair to some kids and the school is ripping then of.

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  61. @Tarun the $5775 is the amount of money one school spent on a dance-a-thon.

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  62. @traundeep i mean if you read the comment alyssa posted it say for the dj it was $325 and i think the 5775 is for the entire dance im not sure alyssa can you confirm

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  63. i am confused tarundeep what are you talking about when did i say about paying for courses are talking about the canada or other countries what I AM CONFUSED. tell me what you were saying again and make it so i am not confused.

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  64. @ talwinder the same thing just happened to me @ zak i agree with you but like you can see this kind of thing can take time to resolve because people would keep arguing about it like we are if only there was a fair way

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  65. @stephanie that is correct. There is also more stats about what each school has spent if you scroll down in the article.

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  66. i agree with talwinder that what i was what i meant by saying that the government should do something about this like maybe lessen the amount of fund for the richer schools so that they can balance it out. BUT NO ONE UNDERSTANDS WHAT I AM TRYING TO SAY!!!!!!!!!

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  67. Usman i agree that it is their earning and they can spend how much they want to but then it is going to be like the article said that the "richer would get richer and the poor will remain poor". That's why i said that the government should have some short of rule or something to make it stable for all the school because then the poor/bottom schools are going to think that they are doing some short of cheating or something and raising their money. And if we don't do this then don't you think it is going to be a injustice to the bottom schools. Because some people can't afford to bring in so much money while some of them could.

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  68. I agree with you hitakshee its like the blog. Those people who are paying for those stuff are relly rich and people like wont able to afford all that.

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  69. i also agree with Stephanie and alyssa that it also deepens if they spent this money donating in some short of fundraising charities like ME to WE or the GIRLS to WOMEN and many more. so yeah i agree with you both.

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  70. @Talwinder the word fair doesnt always describe equity.Just like Mr.cheney said in a lesson this year. When we talk about being fair its not alwyas beign equitable. Its fair that we all get to go to school but that very sytem in its self is not equitable.

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  71. Alyssa its like a waste to spent 5775 on a dance our school spends like 1000 and its still great

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  72. Everybody talks about the world. If the school gives some to donate many people will get new lifes the school and kids will get good prayers from the people.

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  73. i agree tarundeep it is waste to spend 5775 dollars on dance which really is not important instead i think that they should donate it in some short of charity or something that is more reasonable to be spent on.

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  74. @ tarun i agree we all talk about the world when we have the exact same thing arund the corner of our house first we have to stop things in our country not even first we have to solve things in our neighbourhood then get biger.

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  75. @ Stephanie, i think all the money being raised is being put towards student success. I don't think there is anything evil here, thats the problem! In a system where everybody is dedicated to student success it is sadly ironic that such inequality exists.

    @Adam, i think it is simplistically dangerous to think that people with money work harder then those that don't. Its like the concept that "if you follow your dreams you will be a success"...there are hundreds of millions of people that had dreams but never made it. Its far more complex then that. Perhaps investigate why a certain population has controlled the money for decades is a worthy investigation. Once you control the money you yield control over many and there is not an equal playing field for everybody to accumulate wealth. Those students that live with wealth surrounding them already have a distinct advantage and greater chance of obtaining wealth later. Thus the cycle of controlled wealth within a certain group of society is maintained over a long period of time.

    @Cameron, I think are tax money is put to good use, we should investigate how it is spent, but our social services and health care are very strong.

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  76. i agree with you guys, that donating the money in a charity,it will be more reasonable and it will be really useful then giving it to the school which are already rich.But you think the parents and most of the students are going to make this possible

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  77. I agree because to spend $5775 for a 1 time thing that would last for like 2hours or so its a waste there just wasting the funds that are given and for useless things when schools like ours only waste about $200 its just a waste of money and most likely the kids would barely dance

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  78. @Zak i agree, i forgot but i meant to say that i think fair best DESCRIBES Equity.

    @Hitakshee, yeah that is what i have been thinking.

    @Usman, yeah .. i hate when that happens.

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  79. It was said that the way to fix the education system would be to tear it apart.Humans will never reach such purity that they will realize this,and humans will never attain such leadership to get up and actually do it.It's just always going to stay like this because humans CAN fix it but they won't because people will deny it so they can keep learning in richer schools and have higher paid teachers (assumed).

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  80. i think you can't possibly stop this from happening, unless the education system does/make some strict rules.
    But like mr.cheney said,that the rich people are that powerful to bend those too.

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  81. I agree with Mr.Cheney there really is no evil in what is happening but it is also unequal also i think the article didn't give as much details about how the system worked and who actually is part of the richer schools and who is part of the poorer schools(as Mr.Cheney mentioned

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  82. Well when you think about it those other schools get that amount of money because it's how their community acts like. Those schools are in an area where its made for rich people. We live in a middle class area so we would raise that much. Also what Mr cheney said in class how it also deals with rasisism. They live in a area where it could be mostly white's. We live in a area where it's multiculturel so different people from other countries trying to start a new live in a new counrtie. Imagrents...

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  83. @heli Like Global Warming,like hate, and like poverty,this systemic Racism is just going to stay.It'll never be fixed...Or it could.

    Let's just say,hypothetically a bomb dropped on the world.Let's say that only the poorest and riches schools were left.Would the rich donate to the poor? Or would they let the poor die and keep themselves as they were before?

    Would the only way to solve this be a successful,popular person from the rich school that has realized this,the only one with a real voice to speak out could solve it? Against this systemic racism?

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  84. usman i agree this kind of things can take time but if all the people agree or if the government could find out something that everyone can agree with meaning which everyone thinks is fair then i think that it can not take up a lot of time. because i don't think that anyone would say no or argue about this because everyone wants to have good education system.

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  85. if you tried to stop people/parents to stop funding that much,what would the parents think.
    try to think about this, in the parents perspective: all they are trying to do is make their child learning easier and so the child has more opportunities to learn in the future.

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  86. @Brown Kid If the whites being usually richer was related to the history of blacks...Could we say that the minorities have to be poor so our Super-Power Countries can be existent today,since it was the minorities that were slaves? Those minorities back then are now the majority of the population.

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  87. @heli Assuming that *MOST* parents love their children...They all want the best for their children.But every child can't have the best for themselves because there needs to be a pyramid.Without a pyramid,humans aren't valued over others.From the parents' perspective,it would mean that the child isn't as valuable to the world.The only way that you can be the best,is to be better than other people,and at the same time the other peoples' parents want their children to be the best too.

    Almost like a vicious cycle of racism.It's going to continue.

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  88. Heli you know how you said that if the parents and the kids are going to agree to donate to the charities i think that they would agree because everyone know what's going on around the world and by knowing that i think that they would agree with this. when our class won the food drive we got two choices i don't know if it was pizza or sub lunch but whatever and donate to the girls to women or me to we (don't know which one sorry) then when everyone agreed we donate right that way i think that parents and students would agree with this, they would also agree if they are not SELFISH. so i think that it would not be so hard to do this.

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  89. well yeah heli agree with you but don't you think that there should be a limit to this fundraising thing because then the richer are going to be richer and the poor will stay poor. don't you think this.

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  90. Humans just can't change themselves so that everyone gets an even amount.It's almost like there is an instinctive greed in everyone.This need,this thirst for superiority is something that will continue to become worse.And as this thirst for everyone continues,the weak are left behind,in the background.

    It's just not going to change,it's never going to change and it's just something we have to deal with for the rest of our existence.

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  91. @Gurinder I agree this topic is basicly talking about the hostory of the blacks. But from then and now rasism has stopped like alot from what it was before but, In these type of areas this still goes on. It is also how the family grew if they were imigrints from being lower middle class to after 2 - 5 years in this new countrie they get used to the land they were living in. So in this topic there is no evil character, it's just how history has turned.

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  92. @ gurinder
    i agree that it's never going to end but we can try to convince them,a try can't ruined things, can it.
    and if the bomb did drop and destroyed everything else expect the 2 schools, there won't be a reason to talk about money, wouldn't they first think of surviving.

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  93. @Hitakshee Rules are just going to keep being bent,and who knows if they will ever snap?

    The idea that restrictions can be put on people,is just some happy fairy tale but it doesn't happen in real life.TDSB workers can easily create misdocumented budget lists.

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  94. @ heli like gurindr said we can never have true equity humans are greedy none of us has a so called pure heart and even if some how we get equity someone like hitler will always come out to crush it we can never have equity that would mean every one gets paid the same thing but you know what i don't get how come the people that do harder work get paid less like a miner they do much harder work then someone who sits in a office but yet the miner gets paid less

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  95. OMG darthinder why do you always think so negative what make you think that humans will never reach such purity? what make you think that humans will never attain such leadership to get up and actually do it? they can but what make you think humans are not going to do it. is it just because they want their kids to study or get their education in a rich school. i don't think so because if they do then they are selfish.

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  96. @Gurinder thats true human can not change thenselves so that everyone is even. The world will never be even, humans will never be even. There will always be this character thats going to have more power or how u said it more superiority. That is the government trying to hid all there secrets. Thats why the creater of wiki leaks has done this. Spread out to the world of how the government has been keeping secrets to the people.

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  97. @ hitakshee
    that's what i said there should be a limit to funding and fund-raising to the school and the other money they have left they can donate to the charity,but do you think that's possiable ,
    wouldn't most of them be selfish and use the money on planning trip or something like that.

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  98. @heli The ones that ignore the problems are the ones that keep this going,but its not them who are to blame.If you read the post I've made about earlier to ''Brown Kid'' ,the only way that big super power countries are here now is because the minorities are the ones who have to suffer.
    The reason we can have this superiority is because of slaves,and the poor.If there's poor people,we can have big countries.

    A try not ruining it...Trying is something,but having it work out is something that is very unlikely.The way that a problem can be fixed is if someone ''of the people'' can be elected,but it's not that person.It's the person who gets all the high paid voters and unions that gets elected.And that person who will be voted has voters that have the money advantages of the school,and to speak the opposite of systemic racism will turn the voters into a different direction.One that isn't about making everything equal.

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  99. @Hitakshee what gurinder is saying is all true, hes not thinking so negative, he's saying what is reality and what happens out there in the world. Human will never reach such purity. We may be thinking humans are trying to do good for the world but what we are not told is that we can't stop this only try to slow it down.

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  100. @Brown Kid It's like the only reason we have this is because people had to suffer so we can be here right now.All that suffering hasn't been settled yet and it will never be done because the problem is there,it's that nobody will speak out against it and actually have people for this.

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  101. gurinder this is not a big problem that can't be solved, you said that like global warming, hate and much more this can't be fixed but global warming is a really big problem and i know we can't stop that but we can atleast decrease the amount global warming we do and the pollution. so i don't think that this can't be fixed. i think it could be fixed.

    i agree that people are greedy and can't be called pure heart but i still think that we can do this maybe not be able to fix and stop global warming but this is not a big problem we can fix this!.

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  102. 2 hitakshee
    just think, humans together is a dream, they are never going to be united,it's just like the saying,if you dream and work hard it's comes true and that is not always possible.
    9.9 out of 10 people are going be thinking about them first then others,in the real world that's what life is.

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  103. If there are poor people there will always be the rich who will use the poor to get richer. Not in a slave way it's just thats how it is. Poor people will just be used like miterials.

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  104. @Hitakshee The world isn't romanticized as you say it can be in your post.What makes you think that everyone will agree with equality? This giant tower of superiority has been built,and can't be broken down and rebuilt.It's something that the people that run it won't allow to be destroyed because they care more about themselves than they do about others.

    Brb dinner?

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  105. heli i think that it would be possible because i think that there would be more people who would like to donate then spend it on trips and other things which really don't have to be spent on. so i think that it might be a little bit difficult but it's not impossible. what do you think heli?

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  106. @usman You cannot say that indefinetly noone knows what the future holds anything is possible but it probally is unlikely that true equity will be acheived because like mr.cheney says the system secretly promotes this mindset.

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  107. @Gurinder thats so true the reason we are here is because of the poor people. This also connects to child labor because the choclet we get for hallowween or that we can just go to the store and buy it is actully comming from clild labor in africa. The coco beans are picked and shiped by children that are like 9-18. We eat choclet and enjoy it, but what we dont see is that how was it made so it could get to ur hands.

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  108. @ usman
    think how come it doesn't happen so much in Canada, but in countries that have a large population; like in china.their are more poor people there and they are willing to do anything to survive.working hard in an factory and working in an office,it has a huge difference the people who work in offices are USUALLY more... they are more educated then people who work in factories and mining.and it's not their fault for the people who are not that well educated they were not that rich that's all.

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  109. @ Purity,

    a good reason to doubt its possibility is the fact that is has not yet happened. Something we all understand and has been understood for ages should have been accomplished!shouldn't it?

    As sad as it sounds in the raw emotion of humans, taking care of your own survival (thus providing for your child education before others) seems to fit the majority...think of our can food drive! how many people participated for the "right" reasons? we had to learn and make ourselves aware why we should do it, but it wasn't instinctive.

    somebody look up CAPITALISM...this is the society we live in. what does it mean and how does it relate to equality?

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  110. @ hitakshee
    i still stick to the point that 9.9/10 people are going to think about themselves first and how they can take advantage of that.it only some people who have pure hearts and that is really rare now-a days.

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  111. In regards to a bomb! or tearing the system down and starting over...i wonder if it would turn out differently!

    we make a lot of assumptions that if we started over we could and would do it right and equitable! hhmmmmm I wonder how it would look in 1000 years if we tore it all down and started all over! would people work together in harmony?

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  112. @Gurinder exactly that what was in my mind too. The world isn't romanticized because as much as we try ther will never be equality. Wow I just heard on the Tv exactly what we are talking about since the beggining of this topic. People were talking about the argument about how this school has more money to spend then other schools.

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  113. @ heli it isn't rare to find people that way humans have always been that way, what ever opportunity they get they are most likely going to take it.

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  114. Capitalism is an economic and social system in which capital and land, the non-labor factors of production (also known as the means of production), are privately owned; labor, goods and resources are traded in markets; and profit, after taxes, is distributed to the owners or invested in...

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  115. @ mr.cheney
    humans are always humans even if it's a 1000 years back.what i think is that, back then they still believed in different beliefs, right.So that means the soon they would end up like us,it will be different groups and different cultures.
    i don't think it's possible to see all the people work together in harmony.But, some may work who understand what some of us do now.

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  116. @ sharpshooter
    i meant the it's rare to find people who have pure hearts,who are going to think but other people as well as themselves.

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  117. @ cheney tearing it down the system we already have will mess everything up. There will be chances for us to change the way things have been. But people will most likely take this opportunity to have some rules involved.

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  118. So i wasnt here and its too much to read so gurinder ur saying that the whole equity thing can be related to the world and how the earths super powers are like the TDSb.Because i think they are because the government relise on there "minions"(the people in the country) and they promise so much things but in the end fail to keep the promises

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  119. @ heli i know what you mean about thinking about others. But its kinda been that we always think about our selves naturally.

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  120. @Mr Cheney If we actually did start over,it'd still end up being the same.It's a system that you can't change.As hard as someone can try,you might make the situation a little better,but it will only stay like that.

    It's those people high up in the government or education system that aren't going to let it change because of the way its become.It wouldn't be a big evil corporate guy,but it would be the people that make up the education system themselves that will continue in this inequity.

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  121. @ they didn't end up failing to keep their promises they just ended up forgetting about it as if it didn't matter. Like with the freedom of slaves after the american civil war they bent that rule because the person that was incharge of it was no more.

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  122. @Heli thats true it is hard to find people who have pure hearts, but when u think about it there are people who do think about other people but it's just that people cant face the facts that these days life has become about ecomany and bussiness, so people do not really care much any more...

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  123. @Mr Cheney If the same people weren't in power anymore after restarting the system,the power they have due to the more ''powerful people'' that just happen to be whites.

    Because these whites are so rich,they have enough power to join together and go against the idea of equality,meaning that they would rather have their children succeed and the poor stay weak than have everyone fair because they want their children to be the best.And to be the best,it means to be better.

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  124. @sharpshooter
    i agree that's what humans are best at.
    hundreds wait thousands of examples; some we see everyday.gobal warming,cutting down trees to make room for us?don't we have too much room already.Using food like crops to make oil or was it to make is taste like it, i forget, instead of letting the animals using that space for a home.

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  125. @Gurinder thats true even if life started all over again it would just become the same as today. Thats just how life is and how humans are...

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  126. @ cheney capitalism: since there is always things that go on in the world we don't know about like what the government are actually spending our tax money on maybe a new weapon for the military to use that is very deadly, courtesy of a private investor who has interest in it. Also like with these schools that are in these wealthy area like new market Where the place seems so expensive especially by the house.

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  127. @Heli It's not the pure hearts,but the people that see this and then want to do something,and the odds around them actually end up working,letting them achieve the goals.

    I agree it's something like ''one in a million''
    but if that one in the million can't speak the message because their educational past or whatever their racism-influenced past is something that will disqualify them from their chances of giving out their message,when will the vicious cycle end?

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  128. @ gurinder
    i agree,even if the world started again it not going to change the situationist we are in now.UNless we go back in time and fix it ha, that would be fun.

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  129. @ heli a lot of people like to follow others or wait for something to happen, if there is a big enough amount of people then people will start following like with the issue of global warming. These people are adherents they just want to be a part of something big if everyone is doing it.

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  130. @Heli If I had a time machine...Several people in this world would be missing and I'd never make a mistake...

    I think it's okay to say now (in my opinion!),that there is no use to fixing this system because the education system ties in with all the other conflicts in the world.The world will continue to be like this,and we're just going to have to live with it,until we don't have to live with it...

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  131. Its weird that i said kinda alot and no one commonted on any of mine yet and i thought mu first few would be commenting worthy.Weird isnt it,But back on track @mr cheney i think terring down the system adn what not wouldnt make a difference because society itself would stay the same there would be the rich the poor and middle class like if we were in the pioneer there would be men with the best cleanest or most decorative clithes or stronger rifles or weapons and what not so societies awful behavior when it comes to wealthieness will never change because thats just an "instinct" or like something you do when youre wealthy

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  132. @ gurinder or there is some one masquerading this whole thing about the schools that are apparently wealthy, but they have that person just to represent them.

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  133. A capatalist society is one where everyone acts and thinks for their own gain and to link this back to something we've done the south argued that the north with this type of mentality were wrong. So there were soceity's that werent capatalistic.

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  134. @ gurinder
    the "one in a million" are all the ones that know how it feels to be poor and don't get the advantages we do.that's how life is ,we always want things that other people have, OK maybe not always but that's how it is.

    and they don't have the voice to let others know what their doing is affecting them and other things.
    life is not always fair, i know the quote really well but sometimes we or i don't expect it.

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  135. @ gurinder we don't have to tear down the system and make a new one since everything will just be chaotic, instead we can just fix it with some patches or even bend the rules. There is no such thing as a perfect system there will always be loop holes, gaps where we can have opportunity to have it go a certain way.

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  136. This whole school thing is so hard on kids because some kids tend to degrade themselves just because there not in a rich school and start to feel bad but dont realise that money isnt everything

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  137. @gurinder Many people who didnt just settle for having to "live with it" have made great strides what if Mlk Just settled for the terrible treatment him and his people were enduring nothing is a loss cause, Its only a lost cause when people no longer believe thats its able to be completed.

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  138. @sharpshooter Do you mean a fake? Like incorrect figures for the budget?

    Maybe it isn't the people up in the government or education that are doing this.It could be anyone,even people from the poor schools.

    Systematic Racism,is a very interesting topic but I know I won't make a difference until someone else does.Or maybe a difference can be made.

    If Mr Cheney had told us about systematic racism from before the speech competition,this would've easily become a winning speech.This message needs to be spread.

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  139. @El Presidente MLK might of had gotten civil rights for colored,but racism is still here.His efforts,greatly appreciated but when you look at this from the view of looking at the whole world,this kind of problem can't be solved.

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  140. And we dont have to start over to see a better system just look back ( I take this from my own personal experience) and look back to really old islamic nations these were governed with religon and the system its self based on religon had no inequitable traits I think its just when some people start putting there own greedy input into the system that it becomes corrupted and the byproduct is a system like the one were living with in toronto now eg the education system.

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  141. @ Zak, yes there are many types of society's other then Capitalist ones, the point is that we are indeed in a competitive society and they only way to succeed is to be better then others-Capitalism

    @ slavery, yes it can be argued that our world and the power of the superpowers was born from slavery and the exploitation of others...thus to expect superpowers to destroy the thing that made them powerful may seem doubtful

    @ fighting against it, yes it can be faught against, but the first issue is recognition. Where is it, because many of you never would have thought about the education system be unequal until today- despite my many rants on equality and systemic racism

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  142. @gurinder
    same would have went back and fix those mistakes i made.
    i was think about that if we change this then lots of things would have to change and us too since we are involved in it.

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  143. @ Everyone that is still on the blog

    If we separated the world's conflicts into two,there would be Survival and Social.Survival being poverty,global warming and crime.Social being inequality and all the conflicts related to it.

    While the world will struggle to have the people that don't get a chance to speak actually speak,we live with the threat to our existence.How can we have the people with the most sound decisions get on to the top of the social structure to fix the equity issues,at the same time focus on our survival?The same people that don't have advantages like others could be the ones that can save the world right now,but because of inequity,it doesn't happen.

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  144. one could argue that these systems were build inequitably, and if so how can they be equitable if they are not rebuilt and started over...is anybody willing to do this? or do we face the reality it will always exist and do all we can to be aware and move as much towards equality as we can understanding the purity of it may never be reached

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  145. @Mr Cheney Could we say that it would've been better if Europe never discovered anything? If All of Europe died on its own,and the Natives lived their lives until the Earth somehow ended might have been better?

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  146. @gurinder It can, a solution just hasnt been found I link this to something like polio a crippling disease at the time no one believed that a cure was possible.

    And Maybe Mlk's efforts were the first step to the eradication of rascism you can't keep thinking that a solution is not possible because your mind will be shutting it self away from finding a possible solution. It's those that say a solution is not possible and then stay in the middle that are the heart of the problem. We as a people have to at least try and continue to try.

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  147. @ Gurinder those in power of great authority, ultimately owe that authority to the system in which they gained it, it wouldn't make much sense or could it be a realistic expectation that those same leaders would work to tear down the society that has made them powerful.

    the change needs to come from the people...the masses...similar to what happened in Egypt and what is happening in Libya right now, old and powerful rulers are being overthrown by the "people"

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  148. @Mr Cheney If we can think about it differently...Let me give a perspective.

    ''It doesn't matter if others have to suffer,it's not happening to me.That is the thing,it's NOT happening to me.Why should I make a difference if I'd rather live a normal life.''

    That perspective given above,probably of someone in a rich school.How are the poor schools going to do anything? They can't fight back,the rich will become stronger and stronger so they can't do anything about it.

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  149. @thamil i agree money is not everything and some of the schools have alot of money and when it comes times t get into a highschool that not your home highschol the peopel who have gone to the richer schools have more resources then peopel who go to not so rich schools.

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  150. @ Zak, MLKs efforts weren't the first

    @ Gurinder, when speaking about history the word "if" is irrelivant but are you sure that it is only Europeans that are willing and capable of enslaving another human? I'm not sure that is realistic! the human characteristics we talk about I think go beyond geography and skin colour

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  151. @Mr Cheney What is the possibility of something like that happening again? Persistence and this hope is what got them through the fighting so the leader would be overthrown.

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  152. @gurinder its irevalent anyways that was the past and we cant dwell on the past its not healthy we have to think about the now and today and tommorrow's problems its good to learn from the past but to think of what could have been is useless.

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  153. @ Gurinder, yes this is a sound argument if you have everything you are less likely to worry about those who don't. So what you are saying is that the people that have the power to change our world just don't because why bother.

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  154. @Mr Cheney True...Let's just say my comment was an example of a possible scenario.All this racism and the idea of owning something is only here now because of what people did in the past.Because our mistakes can't be fixed,we have to live like this.The ''mistake'' of growing such a high population (I really hope that doesn't offend anyone) has to be paid of by killing us by global warming.Creating waste and polluting the environment...We have to pay for that by having a terrible atmosphere let alone ozone layer.

    These problems just continue to build on each other and it'll just end up going all down in the end.

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  155. Thank you steph for commenting on my comment and like the quote money cannot give you happyness

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  156. @Mr Cheney That is exactly what I am saying!

    In my speech,I did say

    ''Couldn't I say that this world is meaningless and our existence is nothing? Of course I could!''

    That might be the rationale of the ones who are in power and choose to not do anything about it.

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  157. @El Presidente My apologies for the late response...Was in a blog conversation

    The only way we can learn from our mistakes is to actually study what we've done,that is what History is! Using what our failures are,we can change them into tomorrow's new solutions.

    What could of had been is just an interesting way to look at it.Seeing all the possibilities that could of had come from all the decisions.Kind of like the butterfly effect.Making one change in the government's decisions early in our time could of had meant we might've not had systematic racism.

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  158. @Thamil, yes money doesn't buy you happiness but in the area of education it unlevels the playing field for students reaching their dreams. As a student that is something you have a right too, the right to be given the same and equal opportunity to achieve greatness, but as it seems you will have to make up the difference on your own.

    @ Gurinder, yes are world is in the midst of many serous problems, ones that will need drastic action to change...our world can not handle the birth rate as it continues to multiply and yes the ripple effect will be intense to attempt to provide for the humans on our planet.

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  159. @Gurinder, our governments were constructed during a time of racism, slavery, and classism, these could be argued are rooted in the systems themselves (systemic racism)

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  160. @gurinder exactly my point in my previous comment ,looking back is to only study our mistakes thinking about what could have been interesting as it may be is wasting valuable time in our lives when we could be thinking about how to change the bad circumstances we live in now.

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  161. I think that these schools are kind of selfish and they talk about raising money for school,but it always ends up to the point where fix this make it look better,and our school raises money for heart and stroke,terry fox.....etc. but it seems like when they raise the money the only give a small portion to these causes and keep the rest for them.This doesn't even show the equality,but schools always tell us to be equal,the government should come up with a plan to make things equal for the schools, but if those schools are rich they wont really need that much money i think there using it ti show off.

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  162. @ tron master you are right they are going to notice the war between us and them,but as those schools get richer we get poorer,and that will leave a big gap between us and cause this whole commotion.

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  163. But Mr.cheney it doesnt really matter if u have money or not in that situation because if it really was ur dream u would find a way to make them dream a reality

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  164. This Article also reminds me of what happens on the blog, The bloggers that post a lot continue to increase their output, and the bloggers that dont "blog" stay at their position, even if they slightly improve. That is because they are so low on the charts, and the other section bloggers are soo high, that the difference continues to rise, and it will be harder to contend with the bigger bloggers, therefore the lowers will be unable to shine, in the shout-outs, unless they really hustle. When the good gets better, the worse worsens, because, as I said, the difference increases between the two sects. Sooner or later it would be impossible to compare the two. Same thing in this context, the richer schools' circulation of wealth increases, as more and more programs become widely available through the usage of the income from the previous year, and from that, they generate even more income. Whilst that is happening, at the same time, there are schools that aren't necessarily "rolling in the dough", that have the same programs over and over again, that dont generate much income, because of lack of student interest. Indeed, I consider the elementary school system to be capitalistic, where the good students get better, and those who dont care continue to fail, and thus, only a few will succeed, there are many factors to this, some of which could be peer pressure, of the many youth issues we have currently in North America, as well as other parts of the world. An unlikely cause, because of the society of youth in North America, could be that the students do not understand the lesson. That rarely happens because the teachers here are so well taught to balance their classes with all the levels of thinking, atleast thats what my interpretations on that fact is. Whereas, in High school, there are different levels for different thinking levels, and it has indeed allowed many more to succeed, the high school system has indeed changed the capitalism inside the early elementary system.
    Back on topic, the capitalistic relationship between the rich and the poor schools factor and determine what the school outputs, students or cash flow, and those two are indeed the most important parts of the School systems. Cant forget the teachers above all, what good is a school, when there is no one to teach?

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  165. @thamil easier said then done sometimes not all dreams become reality sometimes it only ment to be a dream but with the right things it is possible.

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  166. Who won for the speech? Whoever did, I just lost my two year streak for getting up there (I hope its not Gurinder, my arch-nemesis). Too bad I never got to present.
    P.S. I seriously have to catch up with all that I have missed, including the blog.

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  167. Talha ur whole quote bloggers get better thing mr cheney said in his rant in the morning

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  168. Mr.Cheney you are right with what you said money doesn't buy happiness,but as those schools(wealthy schools)but when they have all that money they have a better chance of understanding things.

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  169. @ Zak,
    Shouldnt they appoint proper management, and see if there is any value in wasting so much money on stimulus plans to have it all disappear? Sometimes the government has to be selfish in some cases, they have to find how to improve a school, rather then pouring money that ends up wasted after a single year. What I am trying to say is that shouldnt the government cover some prerequisites before actually giving the money, like what the school is going to do with it, or what foresights are there for the area that the school is in's development. There are factors, other then that, I agree with your thoughts.

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  170. Stephanie i agree with you 1000% because not all your dreams can come true only the ones that are meant to be.

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  171. @ Master Chief, Wow, Then apparently we must share the same thought patterns, actually never mind that. He is at a way higher level then me. Do you agree with Cheney's/my Comments?

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  172. i agree steph but u dont always need money for ur dream u can just have ur dream based on true skill for example my dad hes a carpenter and he didnt have the money too learn carpentry so he ended up working on our home with his carpenter freind and learnt carpenting skills and he was a fast learner because he had the skill set and his dream wasnt fulfilled with money it was based on love and youre skill or look at profesiona players like soccer they never had money and became pros they used skill then ended upe earning money from there skill to pay for training

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  173. Yeah talha i agree because take me for an example i dont go on blog much and this is the most i posted and when ever i did bad it would make me worst so it makes sense

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  174. The blog went silent so goodnight guys and a merry Christmas and a happy new year

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  175. @ Mr Cheney, The system is indeed inequitable, and it will forever be inequitable, unless there is an ideal case of area for all schools in the Tdsb, where the students and management have the same though patterns and there is no prejudice in their society, therefore leading to total equality between the students and the management. But in reality, we all have different backgrounds, no two humans are alike, we all have different thought patterns, teaching skills, prejudices, etc. So basically I think it is impossible to sustain equality in the school systems when there isn't any equality in the human race, its impossible!

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  176. Talha i would agree with you but i just dont understand youre huge words so very sorry buddy ol pal but i get some of it if there would be an ideal place it wouldnt make a difference beacause the rich hoods like an ideal place but i heard a quote before:Without darkness there is no light without light there is no darkness whick means witht no evil theres no good with no good theres no evil

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  177. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

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  178. @Thamil, as discussed in class the idea that "if you have a dream" as enough to be successful is often false logic, there are many more factors at work-complex, and money is one of them, the roots and influence of money are far reaching and some visible and some invisible, but in our capitalist society they there.

    @Talha yes Darthinder took home the trophy and a 5 dollar gift card from Burger King to celebrate...he told us to roll over and die in his speech!

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  179. Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!
    Ill rob him of his prize.

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  180. @Thamil, as an example, my dream is to teach and be a helping hand with youth, and as such I could argue I have reached my dreams because I love my job, but because my money is secure I can focus on my dreams. But this is possible because I have financial security. (my home, car, daycare, etc are all taken care of because of money, and with them in place I can live out my dream...but if i couldn't afford my home and was being evicted from my home, my dream would become a secondary concern until i took care of my living arrangements ie money)

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  181. Yes i agree Mr.cheney yeah the only the way i was talking about would work is in the olden days and what u say makes sense money is part of all sucessfull careers but when money wasnt needed all u needed was passion

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  182. i Agree Mr.Cheney the root to everything today is basicly MONEY thats all u need if u were wealthy u could get anything

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  183. @vanessa i agree wiht you but with the money they have ,they use it for the schools and the students , eventhough they do have more operunities and also maybe can give some away for the poorer schools in the TDSB but yet they never really would.

    @Crippled Egyptian Pharoah, i agree with you because its true about the equitable in people

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  184. If recognition fails to work;meaning that letting everyone in the education system and in the population gain awareness of this crisis of racism,fear would have to be put into place.A tyrant would have to take over Canada,take all the money from every school and give them an equalized budget that is fair based on how big the school is,how many students are going and if any need unique education programs.The tyrant would need the population to follow this,so he/she would have to put down life threatening rules to stop them from making the education system unbalanced;by leveling the playing field.

    Then again,it doesn't have to be a Tyrant

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  185. That ''tyrant'' could also start fixing Global Warming.If we were to not look at our lives,our feelings and our countries for a moment...We can save the world by genocide.

    Genocide,extreme as it is,would be an extreme but it would need to be done so the countries with the most waste could stop making waste...By wasting them selves.The United States and Canada would have to be bombed by a nuclear bomb so the Earth's temperature will stay where it is.

    But who would actually take power and do something like that?

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  186. @Pharoah You can't tackle me and take my prize, and you never will be able to!

    @Thamil I'd have to disagree about ''needing passion'' to live your dreams.Survival comes before logic, as global warming should come before education.

    To actually succeed or live your dream is something that you can achieve if the influences in your life can work positively for you.By having the positive influences,it makes you have a better chance at ending up where you want to be in your life.But,if education systems were equalized we might not have such skilled doctors or government leaders.

    Equity and Fair advantages or Racism and Possibly Highly Skilled Workers?

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  187. @Vanessa What does ''meant to be'' mean anyway? Is this universe somehow already written down on paper and being followed according to a plan?

    The world just happens to be like this,and we can't do anything to change it because we've already made the decision in our human history to allow racism.By allowing racism,we have some have all their dreams come true at the expense of several failures by several people.

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  188. @Hitakshee If some global cooling sky rocket that lowers the world's temperatures doesn't work,then we will need to commit genocide.Bombing the world's super powers is the way to keep the population down and have low waste.

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  189. @Mr Cheney If Canada turned into a Communist Country,would that make it better? If everyone had to just work and there would be no ''better than other people'' people?

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  190. Gurinder I agree with you about the tyrant its a good idea because if the whole fair money given and earned for each school maximum was different based on the stuff u said it would make the problem go away

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  191. @ Master Chief, I appreciate the fact that you take the time to read my lengthy comments, and Im glad that they get you thinking. Perhaps you should run Dictionary.com in a tab whilst you are blogging? Just a thought.

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  192. LOL ok Talha ill do that.And you should try using less of youre smarticle words okiedokie

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  193. I think that its not fair for the students that are incredibly smart but cant go to school that is for people like them becase they dont have the money to pay for a better school.
    I think this because it not right, the TDSB has enough money for all schools in it to get the same amount of money.

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  194. I agree with Talha "what good is a school when there is no one to teach"
    I agree because there is no point of going to a good school when you arnt goingto toget the education that is needed.

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  195. With added fees, our public schoos will become semi-private schools
    If some schools start charging for materials and outside human resources, those who cannot afford or refuse to pay will have their children denied a meaningful education. Keep public schools accessible to all. No fees for any student.

    From this response it is resonable it doesn't even seem like a public school anymore since the students have to pay for a lot of these things. $100 for an art program that is a good example, paying that much just for a subject is to much. Thats like the price of a small trip for the graduation trip. Pretty soon the school seems like they'll make it a private school because of the prices, like 1200 dollars for a exam. Aren't schools suppose to pay for these things, or a trip that is expensive that's part of the curriculem, don't schools get disscounts?

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  196. You don't need all these 'extras'
    I grew up in a small blue collar town where there was little ability to fundraise and yet, somehow, I ended up getting a great education, graduated from college and now have a solid career working for one of Canada's most successful companies. You know why this happened? Because my parents cared about my education and took a proactive approach to ensuring I was getting the best education possible. They also did things like reading to me almost every night and helping me out with my homework. If parents in low income neighbourhoods did these things for their children, it would have a lot more of an impact on their child's education than a few field trips ever could.

    Submitted by common sense 101 at 12:53 PM Monday, February 28 2011

    That type of story is like a one of a kind.The idea that you can succeed by doing your best is an insult to all that failed.The people that are in the rich schools have these extras because their family history,mainly white history retains this great amount of money.

    What are the possibilities of something like that ever happening again? Having a positive approach to education with diligence in this training is just something not everyone can do. It's great that you've got this successful life now,but it was because the person beside you that might have a rich white family history had the potential and didn't do as well and probably will not do well again because of the financial security they may have.

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  197. Most parents don't like it if other schools are richer then the school their sending their kids too because they don't think kids would have a equal oppurtinuty. And i think that kids would think that their a lower citizen because they don't go to a school thats as "rich" as other peoples.

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  198. Get rid of the Catholic School Board and problems are solved!
    If all money allocated for public schools went to public schools we'd have none of these issues. Anyone looking for a religious education should pay for it, tax money for schools gets divided up appropriately...period. Simple solution and one that our archaic and discriminatory system needs now.

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87 Can Food Drive Total for 2010

2550

A "real" example to leadership, teamwork, and doing something for the greater good.